[STOCKPHOTO] Archival Gold CDs and DVDs

[Jacques Jangoux]

Hello,

I mentioned SlideScribe in my previous post. Surfing around their site
I found Archival Gold CDs and DVDs of the eFilm brand. Anybody knows them?

< http://www.slidescribe.com/cmdn.shtml >

I knew of the Delkin ones. Or is eFilm another brand name for the same
product?

(I had discontinued Kodak ones a few years ago, but my son "stole"
most of them to burn MP3 music).

Jacques Jangoux

[David Riecks]

Post by Jacques Jangoux
I knew of the Delkin ones. Or is eFilm another brand name for the same
product?

Jacques:

If you look at the image of the Gold CD, you'll see that it says
Delkin right on the CD cover.

I was reviewing an article with preliminary results of a NIST test on
CDR's and DVDR's. The Phthalocyanine dye paired with a Gold CDR was
the longest lasting. With most of the DVDR's it's harder to find info
on what Dye they are using, but most at that time, 2004, seemed to be
using Cyanine dyes.

I've been using up the last of stockpile of Kodak CDR's and have been
purchasing the Mitsui/MAM Gold CDR's from Media Supply when I need
the type with a white inkjet printable top.

Hope that helps.

David


--
David Riecks (that's "i" before "e", but the "e" is silent)
***@riecks.com http://www.riecks.com/
Midwest/Chicago ASMP


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Peter Dean]

Post by David Riecks
I've been using up the last of stockpile of Kodak CDR's and have been
purchasing the Mitsui/MAM Gold CDR's from Media Supply when I need
the type with a white inkjet printable top.

David
I just bought a large number of MAM-e from a UK supplier who was
informing his clients MAM-e had gone bust.

Maybe it was just a sales ploy ? ;-))
Hopefully it will continue if rescued? Does anyone know anything i
don't?

The BBC use a lot of these archive DVD's with Phthalocyanine dye. I
still prefer my archive on CD but use DVD for working files. If you want
to know what to use as an archive if MAM-e are bust then watch what the
BBC do and follow.

cheers

Pete

[Picture Partners]

Peter -

And Fuji? The CD's are silver as far as I know, but a 100 year life is promised:

http://www.fujifilm.ca/x854.xml

Frans Rombout
www.picturepartners.nl





----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Dean
To: ***@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 9:08 AM
Subject: Re: [STOCKPHOTO] Archival Gold CDs and DVDs

Post by David Riecks
I've been using up the last of stockpile of Kodak CDR's and have been
purchasing the Mitsui/MAM Gold CDR's from Media Supply when I need
the type with a white inkjet printable top.

David
I just bought a large number of MAM-e from a UK supplier who was
informing his clients MAM-e had gone bust.

Maybe it was just a sales ploy ? ;-))
Hopefully it will continue if rescued? Does anyone know anything i
don't?

The BBC use a lot of these archive DVD's with Phthalocyanine dye. I
still prefer my archive on CD but use DVD for working files. If you want
to know what to use as an archive if MAM-e are bust then watch what the
BBC do and follow.

cheers

Pete
--
Peter Dean (Photographer)
agripicture.com
[phone]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Ian Murray]

Dear all,

Surely the future will be online storage - its already happening with
Digital Railroad and Photoshelter - with duplicate storage sites
around the world with the ability to download and transfer files
anywhere. We'll just process files and then automatically click to
move them to our secure upload area. Agencies will expect high res
delivery online and the idea of mailing shiny disks around the world
or storing them in cabinets will seem laughable. It'll take time
until this is trusted fully but surely it's going to come. Isn't it?

Ian Murray

Post by Picture Partners
Peter -
http://www.fujifilm.ca/x854.xml
Frans Rombout
www.picturepartners.nl
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Dean
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 9:08 AM
Subject: Re: [STOCKPHOTO] Archival Gold CDs and DVDs

Post by David Riecks
I've been using up the last of stockpile of Kodak CDR's and have been
purchasing the Mitsui/MAM Gold CDR's from Media Supply when I need
the type with a white inkjet printable top.

David
I just bought a large number of MAM-e from a UK supplier who was
informing his clients MAM-e had gone bust.
Maybe it was just a sales ploy ? ;-))
Hopefully it will continue if rescued? Does anyone know anything i
don't?
The BBC use a lot of these archive DVD's with Phthalocyanine dye. I
still prefer my archive on CD but use DVD for working files. If you want
to know what to use as an archive if MAM-e are bust then watch what the
BBC do and follow.
cheers
Pete
--
Peter Dean (Photographer)
agripicture.com
[phone]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Rob Wilkinson]

Post by Ian Murray
Surely the future will be online storage - its already happening with
Digital Railroad and Photoshelter - with duplicate storage sites
around the world with the ability to download and transfer files
anywhere. We'll just process files and then automatically click to
move them to our secure upload area. Agencies will expect high res
delivery online and the idea of mailing shiny disks around the world
or storing them in cabinets will seem laughable. It'll take time
until this is trusted fully but surely it's going to come. Isn't it?

You are probably right, I'm sure that will be the future .... but how
safe are the servers that they are stored on ... isn't that just
another hard drive somewhere?
Think I will still back up to CD too (just in case!!).
Cheers
Rob Wilkinson
_______________________________
Portfolio: http://www.robwilkinson.com
Mob: [phone]
_______________________________




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Peter Dean]

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,
Surely the future will be online storage

Ian
I was talking about that place full of dust and cobwebs you don't go
until there is a catastrophe. Ideally this should be in a secure nuclear
bunker! :-) I would regard online storage as a good working archive and
a useful backup as a bonus.

Pete

[Ian Murray]

Post by Peter Dean
Ian
I was talking about that place full of dust and cobwebs you don't go
until there is a catastrophe.

Pete,

Like going home when the pub closes?

Cheers

Ian Murray

[John Fowler]

Post by Peter Dean

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,

Pete
Interesting that PhotoShelter duplicates files at separate
locations on each coast of the US. Good thinking, it seems to me,
even if I don't store full size files there (yet).

Post by Peter Dean

Post by Ian Murray
Surely the future will be online storage

Ian
I was talking about that place full of dust and cobwebs you don't go
until there is a catastrophe. Ideally this should be in a secure nuclear
bunker! :-) I would regard online storage as a good working archive and
a useful backup as a bonus.
Pete
--
Peter Dean (Photographer)
agripicture.com
[phone]

[Jacques Jangoux]

John, Peter, Ian,

What if a hurricane destroys the server on the East Coast and North
Korea sends a nuclear bomb on the server on the West Coast? Better
keep a DVD at home...

Jacques Jangoux

Post by John Fowler

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,

Pete
Interesting that PhotoShelter duplicates files at separate
locations on each coast of the US. Good thinking, it seems to me,
even if I don't store full size files there (yet).

[Peter Dean]

Post by Picture Partners
Peter -

Frans
I will let you know in 100 years ;-)
I think the colours are more related to branding than precious metal but
even if they do contain gold or silver if they don't contain the
unpronounceable and difficult to spell dye i would not regard them as
"archival" . But who knows for sure? Its all a best guesstimate at best;
eh?

cheers
Pete

[Picture Partners]

Peter,

Of course you're right. Easy to promise a 100 year lifetime for a CD or DVD,
if you never live that long to keep the promise. All we can hope for is that
test (simulations) can be done by indepentent scientists.
In the meantime, for safety reasons, I copy my five year old CD's to "archival" DVD's.
And for external harddisks? Hmmmm... in fact they are a small machienes and
therefore just as vulnerable as any computer.

Met groet,
Frans Rombout
www.picturepartners.nl




----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Dean
To: ***@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 4:17 PM
Subject: Re: [STOCKPHOTO] Archival Gold CDs and DVDs

Post by Picture Partners
Peter -

Frans
I will let you know in 100 years ;-)
I think the colours are more related to branding than precious metal but
even if they do contain gold or silver if they don't contain the
unpronounceable and difficult to spell dye i would not regard them as
"archival" . But who knows for sure? Its all a best guesstimate at best;
eh?

cheers
Pete

--
Peter Dean (Photographer)
agripicture.com
[phone]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[David Riecks]

Post by Peter Dean
The BBC use a lot of these archive DVD's with Phthalocyanine dye. I
still prefer my archive on CD but use DVD for working files.

Peter:

How do you know that the DVDR's were created with Phthalocyanine
dye? Is that what MAM-e is claiming?

David


--
David Riecks (that's "i" before "e", but the "e" is silent)
***@riecks.com http://www.riecks.com/
Midwest/Chicago ASMP

[Peter Dean]

Post by David Riecks

Post by Peter Dean
The BBC use a lot of these archive DVD's with Phthalocyanine dye. I
still prefer my archive on CD but use DVD for working files.

How do you know that the DVDR's were created with Phthalocyanine
dye? Is that what MAM-e is claiming?

David
Our UK supplier cdteam.co.uk know a thing or three. Check their site.
Mam-e were making a DVD with the dye but the future is now uncertain.
The BBC were buying a lot of the DVD's. I am using the CD with the dye
but use a scratchproof "normal" TDK DVD for working files together with
hard drives for work in progress. I was considering using the DVD with
dye but its academic unless another company takes over the process. Lets
hope so. If not Taiyo Yuden discs look like replacements for archive if
mam-e don't resurrect according to CD team. If you check their site they
say TY discs may become available as DVD.

When you consider how many RAW files and jpgs will be deleted by
photographers before they get to be seen and the iffy nature of media it
will be a miracle if any 21C images make it to the 22C. But if they do
someone will probably put them in a disused salt mine so they can't be
seen anyway ;-)


cheers
Pete

[David Riecks]

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,
Surely the future will be online storage - its already happening with
Digital Railroad and Photoshelter - with duplicate storage sites
around the world with the ability to download and transfer files
anywhere.

Ian:

Feel free to base your livelihood on backup copies on online services.
I'm not sure I'm that confident that the service I choose will never go
out of business, or decide to increase my costs of storage to the point
where it's prohibitive to leave my information there.

With that in mind I'm going to have at least one archival copy (and
preferably one onsite and one offsite) under my control. One of those
might be on Gold CDR or Gold DVDR.

David

--
David Riecks (that's "i" before "e", but the "e" is silent)
http://www.riecks.com , Chicago Midwest ASMP member
http://zillionbucks.com "The Webhost for your Creative Business"
Chair, SAA Imaging Technology Standards committee
Version 2 of the Controlled Vocabulary Keyword Catalog is out
http://controlledvocabulary.com/imagedatabases/cvkc_order.html

[Ian Murray]

David,

I wouldn't dream of doing so now but in ten to fifteen years I would
be surprised if the problems you mention hadn't been overcome, though
I'd probably still back up my RAWs! The idea of relying on entirely
online banking seemed outrageous only a short few years ago.

Now where are my floppy discs with all those essential Word files?

Ian Murray

Post by David Riecks

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,
Surely the future will be online storage - its already happening with
Digital Railroad and Photoshelter - with duplicate storage sites
around the world with the ability to download and transfer files
anywhere.

Feel free to base your livelihood on backup copies on online

services.

Post by David Riecks
I'm not sure I'm that confident that the service I choose will

never go

Post by David Riecks
out of business, or decide to increase my costs of storage to the point
where it's prohibitive to leave my information there.
With that in mind I'm going to have at least one archival copy (and
preferably one onsite and one offsite) under my control. One of those
might be on Gold CDR or Gold DVDR.
David
--
David Riecks (that's "i" before "e", but the "e" is silent)
http://www.riecks.com , Chicago Midwest ASMP member
http://zillionbucks.com "The Webhost for your Creative Business"
Chair, SAA Imaging Technology Standards committee
Version 2 of the Controlled Vocabulary Keyword Catalog is out
http://controlledvocabulary.com/imagedatabases/cvkc_order.html

[ARLETTE DESRANLEAU]

Post by Ian Murray
I wouldn't dream of doing so now but in ten to fifteen years I would
be surprised if the problems you mention hadn't been overcome, though
I'd probably still back up my RAWs! The idea of relying on entirely
online banking seemed outrageous only a short few years ago.

More than once in the last year or two I have seen entire systems (banking)
come to a grinding halt. ATMs don't function, the bank computers don't, and
because they are so paranoid . . . even if you can find a branch with a
teller, you won't get a cent "until the problem is cleared up sir". These
"systems" are run by "experts" . . . just like your on-line systems. Like
David, I will rely on someone reliable . . . me . . . and a bunch of dust
gathering cds.

Paul Aparycki

[John Fowler]

--- In ***@yahoogroups.com, "ARLETTE DESRANLEAU" <***@...>
wrote:
As one with managament experience at a major bank I can tell you
that's one service where you need redundancy - complete separation of
banking organizations and especially complete separation of
credit/asset functions. Keep your money here, borrow there.

Post by ARLETTE DESRANLEAU
More than once in the last year or two I have seen entire systems (banking)
come to a grinding halt. ATMs don't function, the bank computers don't, and
because they are so paranoid . . . even if you can find a branch with a
teller, you won't get a cent "until the problem is cleared up sir". These
"systems" are run by "experts" . . . just like your on-line

systems. Like

Post by ARLETTE DESRANLEAU
David, I will rely on someone reliable . . . me . . . and a bunch of dust
gathering cds.
Paul Aparycki

[Rubens Abboud]

Post by David Riecks

Post by Ian Murray
Dear all,
Surely the future will be online storage - its already happening with
Digital Railroad and Photoshelter - with duplicate storage sites
around the world with the ability to download and transfer files
anywhere.

Feel free to base your livelihood on backup copies on online

services.

Post by David Riecks
I'm not sure I'm that confident that the service I choose will

never go

Post by David Riecks
out of business, or decide to increase my costs of storage to the point
where it's prohibitive to leave my information there.

Beyond this, online recovery is simply not a practical technology
for most photography operations. Assuming one only needs to recover
250GB of data (which is not a lot for a stock archive) it would take
over 19 days to download it over a dedicated T1 line (i.e. 1.5Mbps).

Of course, most of us do not have dedicated T1s, so a quick quiz to
those using online backups over high-speed cable or ADSL links:

Have you checked your high-speed cable or ADSL contracts to ensure
that your internet provider will allow you to download large amounts
of data in the event of a disaster? What about surcharges?

Have you considered that if you ever have to recover any of your
gigs of data as a result of a large scale natural or man-made
disaster, there's a high likelihood you'll be doing it from a motel
room with only dial-up access available? Have you considered this
might be the same motel housing hundreds of other guests that were
also displaced and who are likely clogging up the phone system with
their own emergencies?

There are much better options out there with 250GB external hard
drives costing less than $100, both in terms of cost, efficiency,
and practicality.

Best regards,

Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

[Ian Murray]

Post by Rubens Abboud
Of course, most of us do not have dedicated T1s, so a quick quiz to
Have you checked your high-speed cable or ADSL contracts to ensure
that your internet provider will allow you to download large amounts
of data in the event of a disaster? What about surcharges?

Rubens,

Ten years ago I first bought a computer. There was next to nothing on
the web. No photo sites. No banking. No online stores. No proper seacrh
engines until Alta Vista. I had 56k dial up.

In 2117 how far will the internet have advanced?

Will computer still come with slots for CDs and DVDs- or will they be
expensive oddities?

I think that the infrastructure will move more and more online. People
will feel compelled to join in or be caught out just as some
traditional agencies have been by online agencies.

In the meantime I use several external hard drives plus DVDs.

Regards,

Ian Murray

[Ian Murray]

Erm...that should have been 2017. I have no plans for 2117 as yet.

Post by Ian Murray
In 2117 how far will the internet have advanced?

Ian Murray

[Jacques Jangoux]

Anyway in 2117 with global warming all CDs and DVDs will have melted...

Jacques Jangoux

Post by Ian Murray
Erm...that should have been 2017. I have no plans for 2117 as yet.

Post by Ian Murray
In 2117 how far will the internet have advanced?

Ian Murray

[Rubens Abboud]

Post by Ian Murray
Ten years ago I first bought a computer. There was next to nothing on
the web. No photo sites. No banking. No online stores. No proper seacrh
engines until Alta Vista. I had 56k dial up.
In 2117 how far will the internet have advanced?

The point was simply that online backup/restore technology is
impractical for today's digital photographer.

You cannot evaluate the long-term viability of a specific technology
in a vaccum.

Consider that slightly over ten years ago, there were no compact flash
cards. Today the technology exists to make a 64GB CF possible.

In 2017, how many people will be backing up online if they can carry
their entire photo archive in a 1TB compact flash card in their shirt
pocket?

Or what if compact flash will no longer be necessary as most of us
will have a 200 mega-pixel retinal implant directly connected to a
SLIMY (SLug Implant MemorY) attached behind our ears once they
discover that a common snail actually has 54 quadrillion zillion
penises and each one of them can be controlled to an erect or floppy
state (binary 1 = erect; 0 = floppy) with an electrical charge?

Best regards,

Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

[Ian Murray]

Post by Rubens Abboud
The point was simply that online backup/restore technology is
impractical for today's digital photographer.

Rubens,

Have a look at Photoshelter.

Ian Murray

[Rubens Abboud]

Post by Ian Murray

Post by Rubens Abboud
The point was simply that online backup/restore technology is
impractical for today's digital photographer.

Rubens,
Have a look at Photoshelter.
Ian Murray

Ian,

As a stock photographer, I would not use Photoshelter as an online
backup/restore solution for the reasons already stated.

One can ooh-and-ahh the technology behind geographically redundant
online backups all one wants, but backups without a practical
recovery strategy is worth diddly-squat. My own recovery time
objective (a.k.a. RTO) is measured in hours, not days, and especially
not 19+ days as is the case of Photoshelter and other similar online
backup services (assuming 250GB of data).

Best regards,

Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

[Ian Murray]

Post by Rubens Abboud
Ian,
As a stock photographer, I would not use Photoshelter as an online
backup/restore solution for the reasons already stated.
One can ooh-and-ahh the technology behind geographically redundant
online backups all one wants, but backups without a practical
recovery strategy is worth diddly-squat. My own recovery time
objective (a.k.a. RTO) is measured in hours, not days, and

especially

Post by Rubens Abboud
not 19+ days as is the case of Photoshelter and other similar

online

Post by Rubens Abboud
backup services (assuming 250GB of data).
Best regards,
Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

Dear Rubens,

I'm not a salesman for Photoshelter but have been very impressed by
them as a customer. It is a very young company and the original basis
of their vision was that of providing online storage at low cost. One
very big advantage to somebody like me with a slow internet
connection is this. Once my images are uploaded I can distribute them
using Photoshelter's very fast internet connection. I have sent
images by ftp from my archive there and they go incredibly fast (
compared to what I am used to!). Of course I still back up all my
images here next to me on DVD and hard disk. But I see a glimpse of
the future in what Photoshelter is offering today. They have several
geographically distinct back ups, I could have several of my own (
yes, in the future when prices get lower for huge masses of space)
and move images around the world to various agencies and storage
sites while I go for a walk or sleep.

Perhaps another feature we will have in the future is online Raw
processing/Photoshop so that after a shoot we'll upload our memory
card and do the editing, uprezzing, keywording, sorting, filing,
dispatch to agencies and storage facilities, and all the rest,
online.

Maybe the ability to offer such a service to agencies/distributors
will sort out those serious about stock from the weekend hobbysists?

This is just pure New Year speculation by the way.

Regards,

Ian Murray

[Rubens Abboud]

Post by Ian Murray
One
very big advantage to somebody like me with a slow internet
connection is this. Once my images are uploaded I can distribute them
using Photoshelter's very fast internet connection. I have sent
images by ftp from my archive there and they go incredibly fast (
compared to what I am used to!).

Ian,

Any web host that offers shell access has the same feature.

Best regards,

Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

[Stockphoto Seller]

Ian,

I agree that it is desireable to be able to do all processing from RAW files to final TIFFs submitted for client use within as few applications as possible; but why, in the current sloppy, unreliable, and unpredictable online atmosphere would you want to do all the below time-consuming (and, therefore, expensive) operations in an online storage site. If you depend on such a site for this processing, you will be faced with downloading the valuable processed images for physical archiving (disks, drives, or whatever).

Better to process master files in one's offline archiving software, back up the polished masters, then upload polished files (of whatever sort you decide to have in Photoshelter or other online storage areas) to the online services, ready to be searched, submitted to clients, distributed to marketing services, etc. This is not to say the processing capabilities (hopefully with lots of batching abilities) would not be good to have in the online storage areas for customizing submissions according to the requirements of specific clients or marketing outlets. Of course, one would hope for more efficient software than bloated, clunky Photoshop for manipulations of what one has stored online.

Carl May/BPS

Ian Murray <***@totalise.co.uk> wrote:
Perhaps another feature we will have in the future is online Raw
processing/Photoshop so that after a shoot we'll upload our memory
card and do the editing, uprezzing, keywording, sorting, filing,
dispatch to agencies and storage facilities, and all the rest,
online.




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Ian Murray]

Post by Stockphoto Seller
Ian,
I agree that it is desireable to be able to do all processing

from RAW files to final TIFFs submitted for client use within as few
applications as possible; but why, in the current sloppy, unreliable,
and unpredictable online atmosphere would you want to do all the
below time-consuming (and, therefore, expensive) operations in an
online storage site. If you depend on such a site for this
processing, you will be faced with downloading the valuable processed
images for physical archiving (disks, drives, or whatever).
Dear Carl,

I was speculating really rather than making proposals. But since you
ask me to I'll speculate a little more. The internet today may indeed
be sloppy but so is my two year old computer and my cheap software
isn't the best either. Processing files can be a real pain. I
understand that it is now possible to access one's own computer
remotely whilst away. Imagine uploading RAW files not into the ether
but to some remote highly advanced computer system with near
unlimited processing power and speed where I can rent access to mind
blowing image processing software that is being managed, maintained
and imporved all the time. Once finished at the press of a button I
can choose to send the files to multiple stores, including my own
hard disk, and also send selections to a range of editors.

In this utopian new future world I will of course by now be twenty
years younger, have a full head of hair, miraculously notice paunch
converted to muscle, and be travelling the world in permanent
sunshine with wads of cash in my pocket. That's the plan anyway.

Regards,

Ian Murray

[Stockphoto Seller]

Ian,

No question it would be nice to subscribe to the latest, fastest service and work there without having to handle everything yourself on your desktop. Microsoft and others have been trying to get businesses to do and store everything online for the past couple of years, but it is not selling well. The Internet is just too unreliable functionally and too insecure.

And what will determine the design of the system in Picture Utopia? It had better be darn flexible, or we will be stuck with something set up to maintain domination by the corporate conglomerates and not in the best interest of individual picture sources. (I know the current Photoshelter managers favor the smaller independent, but who is to say what will happen to them--or Digital Railroad, or whomever--if someone offers a big pile of money for their company?) Or we will get stuck with something designed by committee based on the preferences of focus groups. Just imagine what focus groups full of RF and microstock come-latelys engaged in the race to the bottom might prefer!

For the time being, one needs to be in charge of creating and backing up one's own masters before dispatching them into the Internet muddle, no matter how carefully one chooses for the better elements in that muddle.

Carl May/BPS

Ian Murray <***@totalise.co.uk> wrote:
I was speculating really rather than making proposals. But since you
ask me to I'll speculate a little more. The internet today may indeed
be sloppy but so is my two year old computer and my cheap software
isn't the best either. Processing files can be a real pain. I
understand that it is now possible to access one's own computer
remotely whilst away. Imagine uploading RAW files not into the ether
but to some remote highly advanced computer system with near
unlimited processing power and speed where I can rent access to mind
blowing image processing software that is being managed, maintained
and imporved all the time. Once finished at the press of a button I
can choose to send the files to multiple stores, including my own
hard disk, and also send selections to a range of editors.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jacques Jangoux]

Rubens,

You can use the 19 days to stay away from stock photography and go
through all the stuff you accumulated over the years (like 15-year old
bank statements or telephone bills, computer or photo magazines of 10
years ago (I always keep one by nostalgia), medical prescriptions,
books that you will never read etc). It keeps me busy when my computer
wonŽt work for some reason.

Jacques Jangoux

--- In ***@yahoogroups.com, "Rubens Abboud" <***@...>
wrote:

My own recovery time

Post by Rubens Abboud
objective (a.k.a. RTO) is measured in hours, not days, and especially
not 19+ days as is the case of Photoshelter and other similar online
backup services (assuming 250GB of data).
Best regards,
Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography

[Rubens Abboud]

Post by Ian Murray
Rubens,
You can use the 19 days to stay away from stock photography and go
through all the stuff you accumulated over the years (like 15-year old
bank statements or telephone bills, computer or photo magazines of 10
years ago (I always keep one by nostalgia), medical prescriptions,
books that you will never read etc). It keeps me busy when my computer
wonŽt work for some reason.
Jacques Jangoux

Jacques,

One of the few advantages of living in a small house is that I cannot
afford to keep magazines for 15 years!

I have to throw stuff out continuously otherwise I can't find the
computer.

I own a heavy-duty paper shredder, too. :-)

Best regards,

Rubens.
http://www.TheImageNation.com
Travel stock photography